Listening To America with Clay Jenkinson
Sundays at 11am on FM-1 and FM-3
After more than two decades of devoting 52 programs per year to the life and achievement of Thomas Jefferson, Clay Jenkinson is ready to widen the lens. He has wanted all of his life to head out on the open road, to "light out for the territories before it's too late," to explore when John Steinbeck called "this monster country."
So welcome to Listening to America with Clay Jenkinson. The public radio program and podcast—which is distributed nationally by Prairie Public— will exhibit more continuity than change. Mr. Jefferson will still make regular appearances to articulate his vision of an agrarian, libertarian republic. So, too, will his regular, esteemed guests. They will explore other periods of American history and wrestle with some of the opportunities and challenges of our times in ways that Mr. Jefferson would not recognize.
Clay writes, "I want to do my small part in urging us to have a conversation of good will in which we try to find consensus on the history, the meaning, and the purpose of America, warts and all, but not without genuine celebration of all of the many many things that are right with America."
Latest Episodes
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David Horton sits down with Clay Jenkinson to retrace a whirlwind summer of travel, history and adventure. Clay's journey began in May with a trek to ancient Troy and continued across the American West, following the trail of Theodore Roosevelt. Along the way came an unusual Independence Day in Italy, stops in Las Vegas and California, and a meandering journey along the Missouri River in the footsteps of Lewis and Clark. Clay and David explore the history, surprises and memorable side trips that shaped the journey — and respond to questions and comments from listeners. This episode was recorded on August 6, 2026.
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Clay interviews Richard Battle of Texas about his series of books about the can-do spirit of America. Three of the books tell feel-good stories of character and gumption in the 18th, 19th, and 20th centuries. Mr. Battle believes that the current malaise in the American spirit is caused by a weak education system that fails to tell the story of how much America has achieved and against what odds. When we are tempted to criticize America, Mr. Battle asks, "compared to what?" What other country has as much freedom and opportunity as still exists in the United States? He regards George Washington as the greatest American for holding the independence movement together against nearly impossible odds. He forgives Jefferson for his failures in the larger context of his achievement in the Declaration of Independence. This episode was recorded on July 21, 2026.
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Guest host Russ Eagle and Clay talk about the annual Lewis and Clark Cultural tour, just ended, after three days on the White Cliffs section of the Missouri River in Montana and then three days up in the Bitterroot Mountains on the Lolo or Nez Perce Trail. Twenty guests from around the U.S. and the world joined us for Russ' 14th Lewis and Clark tour and Clay's 26th. The weather was perfect. The river was cool, refreshing, and powerful. Clay and Russ discuss Thomas Jefferson, Lewis and Clark, Native American history, and the status and future of America's public lands. Lewis and Clark crossed the continent between 1803 and 1806. The Expedition is the most famous of all American exploration stories until at least the Apollo Moon landing program of the 1960s. The Lewis and Clark Cultural Tour is physically strenuous. Still, everyone made it up the Wendover Death March, and we had a joyous farewell banquet at Lochsa Lodge west of Missoula. This episode was recorded on August 3, 2026.
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Clay interviews Dr. Ben Abbott of Brigham Young University about the crisis of Great Salt Lake. Great Salt Lake is a terminal lake, which means that water comes in but does not flow out. It's a remnant of ancient Lake Bonneville. The volume of the lake is now down by 70% and the surface area it covers is down 60%. Abbott believes we are not more than half a dozen years from the lake's ecological collapse, which would severely damage the brine shrimp industry, expose a large number of toxic chemicals to the Utah winds with devastating effects on human health, and severely impair Utah's important winter ski industry. The good news is that Dr. Abbott believes we can solve this problem and that the people of Utah are sufficiently aware of the crisis to make the lifestyle changes (none dire) that will save and refresh the lake. Ben Abbott says a U.N. agency has recently declared a Global Water Bankruptcy, but that saving Great Salt Lake can serve as a template for a much wider set of water-use reforms in the United States and beyond. This episode was recorded on July 23, 2026.
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Host David Horton interviews Clay about Christopher Nolan's new blockbuster film on Homer's Odyssey. How closely does it follow the Homeric original? What changes in theme and character did Nolan make to turn the ancient poem into a film for our time? What should we make of the culture war dispute over the casting of a Black woman as Helen of Troy and a transgender actor as Sinon of the Wooden Horse episode? Since Homer makes the story a triumphant homecoming of the last of the heroes of Troy, why does Nolan make Odysseus a man of regret for the role he played in ending the heroic age and bringing on the long Greek Dark Ages? Is Matt Damon an adequate Odysseus? How about Charlize Theron as the goddess Calypso? What themes was Nolan attempting to wrestle with, and how successful was he? Does it help to have a deep background in the Homeric epics, or is it best to see the film with little or no familiarity with the epic tradition? This episode was recorded on July 23, 2026.
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Clay and his travel partner, Russ Eagle, interview the world-renowned sleight of hand magician Joshua Jay in Las Vegas. In addition to wowing audiences across the United States, Joshua Jay performs in America's prisons and encourages criminals, including hardened ones, to take up magic. He has just returned from a tour of war-torn Ukraine, where he lightened the burden of the Ukrainian people, fighting for their national survival against Russian aggression. Clay gave Joshua Jay the tuxedo of one of the 20th century's greatest sleight of hand magicians, Channing Pollock, for Jay's museum of magic in northwest Las Vegas, which also includes Houdini's straitjacket and his famous needle swallowing apparatus. This episode was recorded on July 14, 2026.
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Clay welcomes Sandra Murray to talk about her 40-year career behind the scenes of major Hollywood film productions. Sandra has worked on over 250 films, including Titanic, King Kong, Les Misérables, and The Lord of the Rings trilogy, most often creating the "Making of the Movie" features that accompany distribution. She has worked with some of the major filmmakers of the last half-century, including her friend Clint Eastwood. The American film industry is undergoing a revolutionary set of changes, not all of them, in her opinion, good. Movie theaters are increasingly empty. Streaming is king. Artificial Intelligence and CGI (Computer-Generated Imagery) are transforming special effects. Independent films are easier and less expensive to make, but much harder to distribute. So many films are produced across so many platforms that there is no longer a common body of movies most Americans have seen. Nobody is quite sure where the film industry is headed, but Sandra Murray shares her insights. This episode was recorded on April 10, 2026.
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Clay welcomes Pulitzer Prize-winning historian Joe Ellis to the program to discuss America at 250. Ellis is the author of more than a dozen books about the Early National Period. He has been in several Ken Burns documentaries and a wide range of other media projects. Ellis believes the American republic is in grave danger and could still collapse. Still, he hopes that the American people are waking up to the threat to their now-fragile constitutional order. Clay and Joe examine the debate between Thomas Jefferson, who believed in the goodness of humankind and our ability to govern ourselves rationally, and John Adams' view that human nature crossed the Atlantic Ocean with the colonists of the 17th century, and that human passions and selfishness must be factored into any political system that can survive in the long run. This episode was recorded on June 19, 2026.
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Host David Horton interviews the third president, Thomas Jefferson, about the circumstances surrounding the writing of the most important document in American history. Arguably the most important document in human history. Jefferson insisted that he was only trying to articulate what every American was thinking in the early summer of 1776. David Horton asks Mr. Jefferson to read the entire text of the Declaration, including the 27-point indictment of King George III and the Parliament of England. Jefferson always reminds us that if the other Founders had known how famous this document would become, Jefferson, just 33, and the youngest member of the Virginia delegation to the Continental Congress, would probably not have been chosen to write the Declaration. This episode was recorded on April 24, 2026.
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Clay welcomes one of his favorite guests, Dr. Lindsay Chervinsky, to talk about America at 250. Many Americans are bewildered and frightened by the current state of the Union, unsure how things got so partisan and paralyzed. Instead of offering our personal opinions on the current crisis, we, as historians, attempt to contextualize the present moment within the broad sweep of American history, beginning, of course, with the Founding Fathers. What would Adams and Jefferson say about the world of 2026? Would they be disappointed with us? And what would they urge us to reform as we move forward into the next fifty, one hundred, and two hundred fifty years? And Clay asked Lindsay to point to the Golden Age of American life. You may be surprised by her answer.