Today's Segments:
Wandermore Publishing makes travel guides. Seth Varner is currently visiting every town in North Dakota in search of hidden gems and unique travel ideas. ~~~ Mental health problems have been a growing concern for many years. And with this being Mental Health Awareness Month, we have an excerpt from a recent Prairie Pulse television show as host John Harris visits with Dr. Jon Ulven psychologist with Sanford Behavioral Health.
~~~ In this week's Plains Folk essay, historian Dr. Tom Isern keeps on his prohibition theme with "Spotters and Piggers."
Wandermore Transcipt
Ashley Thornberg
Seth, thanks so much for joining us today.
Seth Varner
Hey, thanks for having me on the radio. Ashley, I appreciate you taking the time to learn more about my project.
Ashley Thornberg
Well, I appreciate you taking the time to learn more about the state that I have lived in most of my life and worked in for all of my professional life here. And I feel like you definitely know way more about the state than I do. Where did this idea come from to visit every single incorporated community in a state?
You've done this already a couple of times now with Nebraska, South Dakota, Kansas, and Iowa.
Seth Varner
Yeah, so funny enough, the whole thing actually comes back to me being bored during COVID. That's literally how the whole idea for the project came about. So I currently live in Nebraska, but as you said, I've been to every incorporated town in my home state, Iowa, South Dakota, Kansas, and now I'm working on North Dakota.
But the idea for Nebraska just came about because I was a freshman in college at the time. You know, COVID hits in March of 2020 and the world essentially ends. You know, we're all...
Ashley Thornberg
Great time to launch travel plans, Seth.
Seth Varner
I know. Well, no one else is on the road. Gas was cheap.
I was bored. So after getting bored of working at Dairy Queen all day, every day, and just really not being able to do a whole lot around my little hometown in Nebraska, I came up with the idea to go visit every incorporated town in Nebraska with one of my buddies. And we went around the state and my mom at one point said, make a Facebook page so I can see your pictures.
I'm like, okay, mom, sure. I'll make a Facebook page and I'll show you where I'm going. Right.
And like somehow, some way that page blew up. And we had all these followers coming in from all over the state. And the media started reaching out.
And kind of at that point, I realized it was going to be a big project. And Facebook page blew up to like 25,000 followers by the end of the year. And I got the idea to write a coffee table book from those followers.
About 40 to 50 people said you should write kind of a travel log slash guide based on the communities you've been to. And I kind of went from there. And that's kind of how the whole company started.
I just did it in other states afterwards.
Ashley Thornberg
Safe to say these books are dedicated to your mom, huh?
Seth Varner
It's, you know, if it weren't for her idea, or even my dad, inspiring travel with me as a kid, like, yeah, this company never would have come about, nor this project, these ideas. Like, I should be working for a pro sports team somewhere. But that's on the back burner.
Ashley Thornberg
Okay.
Seth Varner
Probably not going to happen now.
Ashley Thornberg
Well, the business is called Wandermore Publishing. You can find out more at wandermorepublishing.com. Seth, we've both said the word incorporated town a few times here.
And of course, with places, yes, there is sort of a census or a legal definition of has to have a post office or whatever it is that makes a place a legal or a census designated place. But from your perspective, what makes some place a place, a community, if you will?
Seth Varner
I choose incorporated towns just because they have the mayor, city council, kind of like a local government, and they don't have to rely necessarily on the county. You know, every municipality in the state, they came together because at some point in time, typically in the early 1910s, you know, even before the turn of the century, a group of immigrants came together and they decided to make a little settlement, you know, take advantage of the Homestead Act and all those things. Then the railroad came through and wanted to place a depot and a little town site sprung up and you had your general stores and your barbers moved in and your blacksmiths.
And all these people came together to form a little settlement so they could start their own little economy in the area and help each other thrive with one another. And so, you know, not every one of those little spots necessarily became an incorporated town. But that's kind of the definition I would give as a community.
It's all these people who came from across the world to start a new life in North Dakota. And you see that frequently all over the state. You know, I would say 95% of the towns I'm going to were big railroad towns at one point, whether it be for the great northern, northern Pacific or the Sioux line.
And from there, you know, some communities have grown and some have some have kind of started to fade away a little bit. But I try to visit every one of them, no matter how small the population or how big the city is.
Ashley Thornberg
What kind of commonalities are you seeing on your travels?
Seth Varner
So I was about the whole state is super kind. I mean, down here in Nebraska, we have the whole Nebraska nice singing. I heard the same thing the other states do.
Ashley Thornberg
There's a lot of states I'm noticing say that.
Seth Varner
Oh, yeah, yeah. I put the North Dakota nice thing termed already, too. And I mean, it's true here in the Midwest.
Like, we all look out for each other as neighbors, you know, even even if we have no idea who the other person is, like, you'll always see it on like the interstates and things like people are helping each other change a flat tire or like, in my in my case, you know, I'll be going to a town of 40 people and the closest hotel is an hour away. And people are like, oh, you know, we if you need to couch surfer, if you need somewhere to stay, like feel free to feel free to stay at our place or we'll make you a home cooked meal and those kinds of things. So the hospitality is just amazing.
Ashley Thornberg
Well, yeah, I got to ask you about a budget for this here. This is a huge project.
Seth Varner
So, I mean, honestly, there is no budget. I use basically just the funds that I've received from previous travel guide sales. I wrote a book about each state as I went along, and so I use profits from that.
I'm partnered with Facebook and I make a little bit of money from each post, kind of in the same way that like a YouTuber would make money off of their videos. Very, very similar concepts that Facebook rolled out a couple of years ago. And then I do name contributions for the back of my book.
So if people are, you know, if they're really inspired by my project or if they want to memorialize, you know, a family member, advertise a business, whatever, I allow people to donate five dollars to put a name in the back of the forthcoming North Dakota book for life. And some people take take me up on that offer as well.
Ashley Thornberg
So, well, let's talk a little bit more about this book. The Wander More in North Dakota book is coming out fall of 2024. We are visiting with the creative force Seth Varner behind this project, looking to visit all 355 of the state's incorporated communities throughout 2024.
When we are recording this, you have visited a little more than 70 of those 355 times. Are you going to hit your fall goal?
Seth Varner
Oh, absolutely. So my my whole plan is I will do about an eight. Well, usually it's like seven to nine days or so.
I'll come I'll come to North Dakota and I kind of make my little plan. So I have a Rand McNally map of the state and I'll kind of mark off a region that I think I can reasonably visit within that seven to nine day stretch. And I'll do as much as I possibly can in between those 70 ish towns or so as I'm going around taking pictures and meeting people and doing all that stuff.
So I started in April. My May leg of the journey is actually going to be ongoing, probably when this interview is out on the air. And then I'm hoping to do one more trip in June, July and August.
And then by November, I should have the book ready to go just in time for Christmas.
Ashley Thornberg
And people can follow along on the journey on the Wandermore in North Dakota Facebook page. I want to talk to you about what the role of a coffee table book is in a digital age. A lot of us reading on Kindles and then the role of the travel guide in the age of things like Airbnb experiences and Yelp reviews.
You must be pretty confident that these things are still valuable.
Seth Varner
You know, there's something to be said about actually holding a book in your hands. Like, I don't know about other people, but I personally, I strongly dislike reading on like a Kindle or like an e-device. I know a lot of the older generation would agree with me.
It's like there's just something about being able to go sit on your patio and flip through a book and, you know, read about North Dakota history. Or if you're actually like in the towns, like say you're on the road in western North Dakota, you're in the middle of, I don't know, Theodore Roosevelt National Park, and you want to learn a little bit more about it. And, you know, your phone doesn't work.
There's no data. You can't get service. And so what better thing to have than a little paperback book that you can open up that does not require the Internet and you can flip through and learn some things.
But, you know, we're kind of in the age now where a lot of things have gone digital. Even, you know, I'll admit, even as I research a lot of these towns, a lot of my stuff comes digitally. And then I'll talk to a few people in the communities to get some oral history as well.
But I think there's something to be said just about having that actual hard copy book that kind of resonates with people. And that's why I stick with that. And I don't really ever have plans to do e-books or anything.
Because I just think there's something special about having, you know, something you can take with you wherever you want. And it's always going to work.
Ashley Thornberg
And you're doing all your own photography?
Seth Varner
Yes. So I take all the pictures with my iPhone 12. No, no fancy Nikons or Canons.
Like I did journalism in high school and I know how to use all that stuff. But I've found that iPhone cameras are super high quality. And it's just all about the angles.
Ashley Thornberg
I actually ended up losing a camera on my last vacation. And I can't even bring myself to be sad about it. Because my husband's got a real nice iPhone and he just takes over all of those.
Seth Varner
Well, right. And I even thought to myself before North Dakota, I was like, maybe I should get like the newest iPhone. Because the pictures are going to be that much better.
That's the only reason I upgraded my phone now is to get a better camera. Or maybe more storage.
Ashley Thornberg
Yeah, it's shocking how many things there are happening in our pockets here. A casual mention here of studying journalism in high school. And now here you are publishing books that you didn't even mean to be publishing out.
The last known reference of a job here is a Dairy Queen during a pandemic shortly after college. What prepared you for this?
Seth Varner
So I think it was kind of a combination of things. So Wandermore is kind of a combination of all of my interests. So growing up, I was always very into writing.
Like I loved writing little stories for my classmates. I had a book series called Fluffy the Kitten where I would send my cats on adventures all around the world. And my teachers were nice enough to let me kind of read those out loud to the class.
And I remember as a kid, at least I've been told my first word was book. My very, not mom, not dad. It was book.
Which is crazy to me. And just having that opportunity, you know, like right at a young age, I was enamored or maybe not enamored is the word, but I was fascinated by words. So I took an interest there.
And then I was fortunate enough that my dad was working on this kind of family tree project in which he was going around taking pictures of all these little cemeteries and churches and those kinds of things that were relevant to our family history for that ancestry project. And I got to tag along on some of those trips as like an 11-year-old. And I was taking pictures of the things that interested me, like the water tower.
Or like, I remember taking a picture of a Walmart that was green because I was just fascinated.
Ashley Thornberg
It was like a 10-year-old.
Seth Varner
I was like, I thought they were all blue, you know, like just weird things like that. Things that catch the eye of like a third grader. And so the writing came about, the travel came about.
And then you fast forward like a decade or so. And I helped with the yearbook in high school. So I kind of knew how to lay out books and layouts and all that kind of stuff.
And I started taking pictures. And around the same time, I started planning my family vacations. So you throw all that in with just, you know, me being a Gen Z-er and loving social media.
You know, you combine social media, photography, writing, travel, and then my eventual business degree. All that together comes up with Wandermore Publishing, where I get to travel around taking pictures of little towns and writing about their histories.
Ashley Thornberg
There is a pretty significant post along with each of the towns that you are visiting. Is there a through line, would you say, between what you chose to write about Wynmere versus Cayuga?
Seth Varner
Like, are you saying just like as far as the things I choose to write about?
Ashley Thornberg
Yeah, yeah, yeah. What, you know, of all the history of all of these little towns, is there a through line of what ends up making it into your post?
Seth Varner
Mm-hmm. So, I mean, I use anywhere between probably 15 and 20 sources per post. I have access to a ton of old, like, centennial books.
Shout out to the North Dakota Historical Society, Digital Horizons, for that. As well as some other things, like railroad books and those kinds of things. And so, you know, a lot of the time, I'll read the full history of a town.
So I'll be going through for like, it could be an hour or so just reading. And then my mind, I'm like, okay, like, what stands out to me? So I try to focus on what happens, like, when the town was being formulated.
So I'll mention like the railroad and how it got its name. And like, maybe some of the original settlers and businesses. And then I try to focus on things that really stand out to me.
It's like, okay, like, did they have an early university? That's, you know, maybe it's been closed for 130 years. And people wouldn't know about that.
Or like, who are some of the famous people from town? Like, what are the famous sites? It's just like, things that kind of make it almost like a little, like, kind of like a trivia book, in a way.
Just fun little facts like that. I kind of try to throw in there. And then as well as like the big tourism stops.
It's like, you know, everyone loves like, you know, it's, there's different things for each person. Like recreation areas are a great thing to talk about. Or like, getting more specific.
Like, I know in the book, I'll be mentioning, or at least I'll be listing out every golf course, brewery, because it's just big things for people. I'll mention every museum that I come across, and some of the things that are there and whatnot. And then even like National Register of Historic Places, which covers everything from, you know, the longest running theater in North Dakota, to, you know, the old, you know, the old railroad bridges that are still prominent throughout the state.
Just like kind of all kinds of neat sites that people can see.
Ashley Thornberg
Yeah. What do you think it says about a place? How we decide what to call things.
Like you talk about Winemere being named after, I believe it was a lake in England, or Wahalla, where I grew up, famed in Norse mythology as a valley of the gods. What does it say about us, what we call things?
Seth Varner
You know, I love reading about how the towns got their name. So I will say like the vast majority, a lot of it dates back to the early railroaders. It's like, they'll name it for like a daughter of a railroad official, or like Hillsboro is named for James J.
Hill, who was like responsible for like extending the, I don't remember which railroad, I think it's the Great Northern, or the Northern Pacific, one of the two, all the way across the state. You know, they called him like the empire builder back in the day, because he was responsible for so many towns. But I think it's cool too, a lot of early immigrants, it's like they kind of give an ode to their old, where they came from.
Like, I think of places like Strasburg, that's a very German name, and everything around there was settled, probably by Germans. And, oh, I don't know what like other examples.
Ashley Thornberg
So fairly German speaking, as far as I know.
Seth Varner
Yeah, as of the 2000 census, some of those towns like where they had like 50% of the population still spoke German, which I think is fascinating. Like it survives, you know, that long, like 2000 was not that long ago. So it's very cool to see how people come up with the names they do.
Ashley Thornberg
Do you have a different approach in storytelling at all when it comes to indigenous communities? And I'm thinking of in earlier response that you said, you know, it's these communities coming together, these people coming together, and creating a life and forging things. And obviously, if you are among an indigenous population, your interpretation, your lived experience would be very, very different.
What is your approach when it comes to the five native nations represented in North Dakota's geography?
Seth Varner
So I'll try to do a little bit of like the history of like the tribes or like, you know, the people who came here long before the Europeans, you know, essentially took over for lack of a better term, you know. But I think it's cool how you see a lot of that heritage kind of spread throughout the state still. And I personally have not had the chance to visit one of the reservations yet.
But on this next trip, I'll be up in the Fort Totten area, as well as like Devil's Lake. And it'll be kind of interesting to see like, you know, there's very large indigenous populations still living in that community. So being able to hopefully talk to some of those people and, you know, hearing about like, what maybe what life was like for their ancestors long before like the European settlers and the Iron Horse was built through and everything.
But I haven't had much experience yet, but I am looking forward to checking out some of those areas, because they were the original people of North Dakota and they play a vital role in the state's history.
Ashley Thornberg
What's your end game with this project? You said something about working for a professional sports team. I'm assuming you're not meaning as an athlete, because usually you have to know that by 24.
Seth Varner
Oh, yeah, by then, long before then. So I joke about that because because of COVID, so I was a marketing sales major at the time, and I was working for the University of Nebraska athletic department, which may be familiar to some of those living in Grand Forks, because of the hockey rivalry that goes on between the schools. That was originally my career path is I was going to be working for a professional sports team.
And then because of COVID, I got sent home. And that boredom drove me to come up with this idea to start visiting every community in Nebraska. And because of the success of that, I had a lot of fun with it and I learned a lot and it kind of combined all my passions into one.
So that's led me now to my fifth state, North Dakota. And I hope over the next few years, I want to be able to say I visited every incorporated town in at least 10 states. And from there, once that 10th book is published, I'll kind of reevaluate.
And I have a girlfriend, soon fiance, she knows, that's okay.
Ashley Thornberg
Okay, I was like, you know, this is going out on the air, right?
Seth Varner
She knows, she doesn't know when or where or any of the details, just that it's happening at some point this year. So we'll evaluate and we'll see at that point, like, okay, can I still continue to do this and raise a family? Like, is this reasonable for me to keep doing?
But I'm only, once I'm done with North Dakota, I'm only halfway to my goal. So I'll be doing this for several years yet. And then after that, you know, I can't imagine I'll be touching any professional sports teams unless someone moves to Omaha.
Ashley Thornberg
I will- Yeah, we haven't been to states with professional teams yet.
Seth Varner
Yeah, ironically, yeah.
Ashley Thornberg
I guess you were in Kansas.
Seth Varner
I was gonna say, they have the one soccer team in Kansas. And other than that, like there's no pro sports teams throughout these states. So I might work in, you know, Nebraska State Tourism or maybe Wandermore.
Like I'll become more of like a travel agent kind of guy or something. I mean, I don't know. I kind of like to say the whole nobody knows more than Wandermore thing because, you know, you go online and like you might look at TripAdvisor or like some of these other big companies or you'll read these books from people who live in New York, but they're writing about North Dakota.
And it's like, well, I don't think they would know more than someone who's actually been to everywhere in the state. So we'll see down the road what Wandermore holds for me. But I know I got a lot of travels ahead of me still.
Ashley Thornberg
What's the number one thing you've eaten so far that you regret?
Seth Varner
That I regret?
Ashley Thornberg
I'm gonna throw you under a bus.
Seth Varner
Oh boy. I was expecting my favorite food.
Ashley Thornberg
I know, I know.
Seth Varner
Oh, thing I regret. I don't know if I've tried anything super crazy. I have a pretty tolerant stomach until it comes to like super spicy stuff.
Ashley Thornberg
Oh, well, that's not gonna happen.
Seth Varner
Yeah, I was gonna say, I'm trying to think like, hmm, you know, I've had some really good things to eat like Wishek sausage and then grandmas who can come to mind. Like that's some of my favorites or like the French dip. I've tried a lot of that.
And there's a, I wanna say it's, is it Nopala soup?
Ashley Thornberg
Knoephla.
Seth Varner
Knoephla, soup. See, I'm from Nebraska. That's not a thing down there.
Ashley Thornberg
Yep.
Seth Varner
I have yet to try that, but I'm looking forward to it.
Ashley Thornberg
Well, that one is a delicious one and we'll hook you up with our own Rick Gion here who has done a knoephla tasting across the state and he will give you a great deal of suggestions.
Seth Varner
I need to know, I need to know the best restaurant. Not Nopala, Knoephla soup.
Ashley Thornberg
Seth Varner of the Wander More in North Dakota project. You can follow along on the Wander More in North Dakota Facebook page or learn more at wandermorepublishing.com. The travel book is due out just around Thanksgiving.
Thank you so much for your time today, Seth.
Seth Varner
Yeah, thanks for taking some time to talk to me and I'm looking forward to seeing what the rest of the Peace Guard has to offer. It's been one of my favorite states so far. Actually my most favorite up to this point.
So I'm excited to see what the other 200 communities have to offer.
NOTE: Prairie Public transcripts are created on a rush deadline by turboscribe.ai. This text may not be in its final form and may be updated or revised in the future. Accuracy and availability may vary. The authoritative record of "Main Street" is the audio record of the show.